Police Minister Ginny Andersen said she wants Kiwis to feel safe but refused to say whether people felt safer now or six years ago under the last National Government.
Andersen's comments come as opposition parties attempt to push the Government on its law and order record amid an election year, with National and ACT quick to chastise the Police Minister's interview in the hour after it went to air.
Official police data has shown several metrics of crime have grown over the past six years. Between 2017 and 2022, the number of serious assault reports increased by 121%, while reports of acts intended to cause injury went up by almost 30%.
Speaking to Q+A, the Police Minister was pressed about how voters should assess their Government's performance on law and order.
"I've always said that my aim as Police Minister is to try and make New Zealanders feel safe," she said.
But, when repeatedly asked, Andersen said she wasn't "bold" enough to say people felt safer under a Labour Government.
"Look, I'm not going to be as bold to say that," she said. "Because I haven't spoken to every single New Zealander to see how they feel."
However, she added: "I believe we are safer with 1800 more police officers on the beat, and that's what we'll achieve next month."
Andersen said that while her primary goal was making sure people felt safe, it was "probably an impossible task to measure" when evaluating.
"As a goal, that's what I would like to do. I don't know if you have a happy- or a safe-o-meter within everybody. I think that's probably an impossible task to measure," she said.
A 25-year-old and a 26-year-old have been jointly charged with wounding with reckless disregard and injuring with reckless disregard. (Source: 1News)
The Police Minister was repeatedly pushed by interviewer Jack Tame about whether certain rates of crime needed to come down in order to make Kiwis feel safe.
"Crime has become more brazen, and that does make people concerned, but in so many instances — and I keep a close eye out on what happens in reports — police have always gone in there and got someone really close," she said.
"There's always an apprehension in most of these cases, and largely that's due to the fact that we have a resourced police service."
Tame asked: "Do you need to see those numbers come down for New Zealanders to feel safe?"
The Minister responded: "I think we do."
Official statistics also show that reported retail crime doubled between 2018 and 2022.
So who is the new Minister of Police? (Source: 1News)
Andersen said small business owners she'd met felt safer than they did under the previous National Government — if they had a fog cannon installed.
"I'm not talking about every single one, but the ones I have visited and seen — once they've had an installation of a fog cannon — do feel safer."
Additionally, she said that the large jump in reported incidents was partially down to a new app, which Andersen suggested meant more people were reporting retail crime.
"One of the main reasons that is driving the increase of retail crime reports is a new app, which is really helpful, called Auror, that enables small low-level crime to be reported to police.
"The use of that app has caused so much more crime at a lower level to be reported.
"From looking at police statistics, the number went up significantly once police were receiving information from the Auror app — which enables every retail owner to upload and report their own crime."
'All excuses, no solutions' and 'gaslighting'
Responding to Andersen's interview, National's police spokesperson Paul Goldsmith said in a media release that the Government was trying to "gaslight" Kiwis about crime.
"The Police Minister is gaslighting New Zealanders by saying in an interview on Q+A this morning that the only reason crime is up is because it's being reported more," he said.
"The sad reality of life under Labour is that, for many, joining a gang is a more attractive proposition than many other pathways.
"National will fix the economy and restore fiscal discipline, so we can afford the resources frontline police need and keep Kiwis safe."
Meanwhile, ACT's police spokesperson Chris Baillie said the interview showed the Minister was responding with "excuse after excuse".
"When confronted with specific evidence of how out of control crime is on Q+A this morning, all that Police Minister Ginny Anderson could come up with was excuse after excuse," he said.
"When asked about the fact that retail crime has doubled under Labour, she said that is just due to an uptick in reporting from retailers.
"The Minister refuses to face facts. Crime is out of control and the Government isn’t doing enough to ensure New Zealanders' safety."
Q+A with Jack Tame is public interest journalism funded by NZ on Air
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