Should NZ do business in Taliban-ruled Afghanistan?

In the conclusion of a three-part series marking the third anniversary of the Taliban seizing power in Afghanistan, Simon Mercep meets Kiwis running a business there who want more trade with the regime. But it's a call strongly rejected by another New Zealander fighting for human rights in the country.

They are two women who have set up shop in a country widely condemned for an appalling human rights record, especially with regards to women. But Auckland business partners Emma Conyngham and Rahila Sayed say they are doing the right thing in Afghanistan.

"If Afghanistan is going to get on its feet in any way, then we need to invest," said Conyngham. She was a humanitarian worker in Afghanistan in the early 2000s for several organisations, including the UN Development Fund.

In 2020 she set up a business here called Waste Free Celebrations, making recyclable gift bags and Christmas crackers. With her Afghan connections, she initially employed refugee women. This year, with the help of partner Rahila Sayed, manufacturing moved to Kabul, where costs were lower, and they hired local women.

"Afghanistan has had 40 years of fighting," says Rahila. "There are lots of widows who don't have anyone to look after them, and they need a job."

She went to Kabul in January to set up the business. Twenty-six women are now employed sewing the gift bags.

"Now that they have a job they are so happy," she says. "And hopeful."

Conyngham said queues of women desperate for work form each morning outside their business.

"They're begging. It's the most heartbreaking thing but we don't have enough sewing machines."

The pair visited Kabul in April, where they say Taliban officials were so welcoming they offered to display their Christian-themed products in a government ministry office.

"He said all religions are welcome and he wanted an environment for investors to come," Conyngham said.

"I walked out with my jaw dropping," she said. "Rahila and I looked at each other just going 'is this actually happening?"

The pair say the time is right for the New Zealand Government to step in and encourage trade and investment.

"I think it would be better if we recognised the Taliban as the legitimate government, and that we were playing a part in the country rather than standing outside throwing stones. I don't think that's helpful," Conyngham said.

But that argument doesn't wash with Richard Bennett, the UN's Special Rapporteur for Afghanistan, charged with monitoring human rights in the country.

"The Taliban should not get normalisation for free," he said.

The Taliban resumed power in 2021 and is not recognised as the official government by most nations, who regard it as a terrorist entity.

"Human rights have tracked steadily downwards," Bennett said.

The New Zealander, who worked for the Human Rights Commission here, said many cases are reported of extrajudicial killings and the torture of former government officials. Dissent is not tolerated.

And in his latest report to the UN, he said the Taliban has institutionalised discrimination against women and girls.

"It's unparalled anywhere in the world," he said.

Under the Taliban's strict interpretation of Islam, he said women cannot go to high school and work in professional roles. Their freedom of movement is also restricted.

"I think New Zealand should avoid any kind of normalisation of a regime which treats human beings and especially women and girls the way they are currently treated in Afghanistan."

Conyngham agreed that the Taliban's human rights record is of huge concern.

"What I have learned is that it is possible for two things to be true at the same time," she said. "It is horrific on one hand, but the Taliban is also very welcoming, wanting investment on the other hand."

She can't do anything about human rights, but said she can offer much needed employment.

And if New Zealand can trade with China despite concerns over its human rights record, it should be able to do the same with Afghanistan.

"I think we're picking and choosing inconsistently."

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade says New Zealand has a long standing policy of not making formal statements of recognition of governments.

"The Taliban is currently designated as a terrorist entity under New Zealand law and is subject to United Nations sanctions which place significant restrictions on how we can engage with them."

MFAT said New Zealand has spent $38.5 million on humanitarian and development assistance since 2021. It said this reflected the country's concern about the humanitarian, economic and security situation in Afghanistan.