Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern reemphasised today that her focus in the case of Kiwi ISIS member Mark Taylor is to keep New Zealanders safe. But the man also known as the “bumbling jihadist" is very unlikely a threat, and could even provide "potential intelligence value", a security expert countered.
The two spoke on the issue during separate interviews this morning on TVNZ1’s Breakfast.
It comes one day after news broke that the Kiwi is now being held in a Syrian prison after surrendering to Kurdish forces, who would prefer to send the Hamilton native back to New Zealand.
It doesn't appear New Zealand officials will have much of a choice in the matter because blocking his return would leave him stateless, security analyst Paul Buchanan said.
"Under international law, even though he renounced his citizenship and very publicly burnt his passport, we do have an obligation to take him back," he explained. "Why would we inflict him on the Kurds? He’s not really their problem.
"The problem is political and it’s in Wellington, not in Syria."
If Taylor comes back to New Zealand, he will most likely face legal action.
"This will be an excellent test case of our anti-terriosm legalisation, because he’s already admitted to committing crimes under that legislation,” Mr Buchanan explained, opining on the range of sentences he might be eligible for if convicted.
"On the low end, he might be facing six to seven years for being an accessory to crimes or being part of a terrorist enterprise," he said.
But more than likely, Taylor has done much more than that, Buchanan believes.
“I have a feeling his involvement in such things [beheadings and killings] is more than just watching," he said. "If that’s the case, then he’s complicit, and war crimes are crimes against humanity. There’s no death penalty in New Zealand but the penalties for doing that…[are] a little more severe than six to seven [years].
"He’s admitted that he would have loved to have had a slave, and enslaving people is a crime against humanity."
The security expert referred to how Taylor received his "bumbling jihadist" nickname is assessing his risk to fellow New Zealanders.
"The whole leaving his GPS on him [while tweeting for ISIS] and everything indicates that he is not the most cunning fellow," he said, adding that he would "love to be there" as Taylor is interrogated by New Zealand officials.
"He could give us much more information about recruiting," he said. “I say yes, hold your nose and bring him back here, but it’s going to be quite the spectacle.”
Jacinda Ardern says her focus is keeping New Zealanders safe
The PM told TVNZ1’s Breakfast that she has explicitly warned not to travel to Syria because “we do not have the ability to give assistance”. (Source: Other)
In a separate interview with Breakfast, Ms Ardern acknowledged that Taylor cannot be stateless but also said the Government does not have the ability to give assistance to him.
"We explicitly have said time and time again, 'Do not travel to Syria, we do not have representation in Syria, we do not have consulate assistance, we do not have the ability to give assistance and we do not have any connections with the forces there'," she said.
That being said, New Zealand clearly has a responsibility in the situation, she said.
"Countries are not meant to make anyone stateless and for very good reason," she siad. "That would essentially make him someone else’s problem."
The Prime Minister said her focus at the moment is on keeping New Zealanders safe.
"I can give the assurance that we have a framework that we can do that for New Zealanders."
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